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Haunted mince pies?


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Matt.H
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Joined: 6 Nov 2008

Yesterday evening I remarked to my girlfriend that a pack of mince pies were sitting on the counter top in the kitchen when before they'd been stored away. I definitely hadn't moved them, and she said she'd been in there just moments before and had actually moved them from the cupboard to the top of the microwave, not the countertop. She was adamant about this, and there seems no reason to doubt her.

This got me thinking. If it was a "ghost" that had moved the mince pies, why on earth did they choose to do such a bizarre thing to, apparently, get out attention? Why not move one of my books on the paranormal - surely that would have been a more appropriate and obvious way of getting my attention?

Assuming that neither of us did move the mince pies, it seems like one hell of a leap of logic to assume that a discarnate spirit or somesuch was to blame. Which leads me to my question - do you think that for many "hauntings" that can't be rationalised we should be looking into perinormal explanations (I'd tentatively suggest potential links to things such as the many-worlds theory, although I'm far from an authority on such matters) rather than clunky survival-after-death possibilities?

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Ian Topham
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Joined: 22 Jul 2008
Taking that perimormal can

Taking that perimormal can be described as unknown forces which at first appear to be paranormal and later are verified scientifically. (this may not be a good definition but the best I could find) Does that mean we regard an experience as paranormal until we can prove it is not?  Or just assume that everything is normal, we just can't prove it yet?

Jumping to a paranormal conclusion reminds me of a post I read on another paranormal forum.  Somebody was driving at night and ran over a rabbit.  Both the driver and passenger saw the rabbit and felt the impact, but when they stopped and ran back down the road to helpthe critter, they couldn't find it.  Instead of assuming that they didn't kill it dead on the spot and it managed to get into hiding, where no doubt it soon died, they jumped to the conclusion that the rabbit was not real.  They posted that it must have been somekind of spirit sending them a message.

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Agricola
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Joined: 15 Oct 2008
I think you're girlfriend

I think you're girlfriend was caught redhanded trying to sneak a mince pie behind your back. Pretending a ghost left them out when someone has just walked in the room is an old trick known to be used by mince pie dependents such as my other half who does this every year. My solution has been to get in there first and eat all the mince pies before he has chance to.

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Daniel Parkinson
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Joined: 22 Jul 2008
I think it comes down to

I think it comes down to what you believe, as that is the conclusion that is most likley to come first. Regardless of actual explanation.

On Agricolas point, I have been trying to convince my better half for years that there is an Alchohol consuming ghosts that finishes off any drink left around the house - leaving empty bottles in situ. Usually happens after coming in from a night out - could be a pattern here.

On the rabbit perhaps there was a Hugh Fearnley Whittingstall type lurking behind a hedge who made off with the roadkill for his supper - any less likley than a phantom rabbit?

Columbine
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Joined: 24 Nov 2008
 Vis the rabbit; you'd be

 Vis the rabbit; you'd be amazed at how far the little critters can bounce off of a bumper, or contrive to lodge themselves in the wheel arch until after you drive off (please note, i don't make a habit of squishing bunnies in a 4x4; i just live in an area with a lot of rabbits. Best one I saw had ricocheted half way up into the hawthorn hedge). 

I had a perculiar experience with a spider once, however. One summer we were getting absolutely enormous ones crawling up out of the drains; not the cutsy common house variety, oh no, we're talking big fat hairy bodies as big as my thumb with legs to match. In a moment of bravery (i'm fine if the little monsters stay still) i picked up a large flip flop and smashed it down on one on my kitchen wall. It had nowhere easy to run to for cover, and i'm pretty sure i hit it; but there was no traces of it anywhere- no ooze on the wall or the flip-flop. 

So either it evaporated when i hit it; or i was for no apparent reason hallucinating a spider. 

Or ghost spiders? 

To he honest though, i think a good number of 'ghost' sightings are due to normal abberations in brain activity due to tiredness/stress etc. I can think of a number of people who hallucinated due to bereavement, and who hasn't randomly put something in a silly place and had no memory of doing so? My mother's a good one for that- mobile phone in the fridge and tea pot in the microwave. oy vey. 

Mysteryshopper
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Joined: 15 Oct 2008
The mince pie incident is

The mince pie incident is more likely xenonormal than perinormal. A xenonormal incident  is something that appears paranormal but has a mundane explanation. So there's no need to invoke quantum theory here. This is almost certainly a case of  short term memory not being converted to long term memory.

An alternative explanation for the rabbit story is misperception. It wasn't a rabbit at all but a bit of wind blown litter. The 'felt' something because, by then, they were expecting to.

The tendency to invoke ghosts to explain weird incidents is cultural. If we had all been brought up believing in invisible one-legged jelly monsters (instead of ghosts), they would no doubt get the blame for such incidents.

Matt.H
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Joined: 6 Nov 2008
Yes I agree that a

Yes I agree that a xenonormal explanation is likely in the mince pie case, although it's difficult to see why she would have moved them about half a foot to the left after already removing them from the cupboard in order to put them on the microwave.

It is pretty scary how cultural conditioning can preclude people from considering likely explanations.

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Ian Topham
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Mysteryshopper
Mysteryshopper wrote:

invisible one-legged jelly monsters

So I'm not the only one who has seen them......I thought I was going mad ....wibble

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Red Don
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Joined: 19 Oct 2008
Sorry guys, I've never heard

Sorry guys, I've never heard of xenonormal or perinormal.  Are they new terms used within the investigating fraternity?

Mysteryshopper
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Xenonormal defined here

Xenonormal defined here

Matt.H
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Joined: 6 Nov 2008
Xenormal's basically

Xenormal's basically a fancy word for "make sure you look into all feasibilities when investigating". Importantly, this includes exploring issues you may not have come across before.

Thinking about it, I'm not sure you could say the "mince pie incident" was truly xenonormal, as I was aware there may well have been an explanation such as the one offered by Mysteryshopper.



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